High Times Article & the State of Raving

house.54.165: Wagner James Au (wjamesau) Sun 1 Jan 95 19:14

(megatrip), there is no such entity called "society". You cannot
attatch it to a verb without appearing absurd. "Society" has never
abused a single child, never isolated anyone from anything, never
prevented anyone from having feelings. These acts are done by
individuals choosing to act this way. When people use the term
"society" so broadly and sloppily, they are invariably attempting
to justify their own elitism and contempt for everyone who isn't as
enlightened as they are.

house.54.166: David Dei (megatrip) Mon 2 Jan 95 14:35

The idea of "society" or the "socius" is the collective "body" or
political entity of which their are many forms. Although some consider
this merely an abstract concept, in Hobbes' "Levaithian" or Jungs
treatise on the Collective Unconsious, we see the idea that groups of
humans can be considered in collective terms. Whether such a collective
body exists is open to debate, but is no less flawed than the idea that
we have such a thing as an "ego" or "superego", in short there are many
who would consider the idea of "free will" or "individuality" as being
equally absurd.

house.54.167: Hubert Ogglefloss (mc2) Mon 2 Jan 95 17:02


house.54.168: Michael Shields (scripta) Mon 2 Jan 95 17:34

see very interesting books on paganism and anti-mono-Godisms by
Ginette Paris...called Pagan Meditations, Pagan Grace, and the Sacrament of
Abortion. A Real anti-dote to "pope" as Time magazine's "Man" of year.

house.54.169: Wagner James Au (wjamesau) Mon 2 Jan 95 19:43

#166 says, in other words, (megatrip) can think of no cogent
rationale to attach a verb to the word "society", but is going
to do so anyway.

house.54.170: David Dei (megatrip) Mon 2 Jan 95 21:25

lack of complexity again Holmes. The point was, we can talk about
"society" as having a "body", and therefore "acting". (which means we can
use all those nice verbs) What I would rather talk about is whether the
sum total of human behaviour, the socius or collective unconscious or
zietgeist or supersoul is inherently good or bad? The dialectical drama of
individual and society is surely far from over, and I would argue that
ideas of evolutionary critical mass are not yet irrelevent. If our
individual actions affect the group mind and vice versa, then the obvious
trick would be to uncover the mechanisms whereby the whole shebang can can
be steered towards peace, love and harmony.

house.54.171: Raymond (megatrip) Mon 2 Jan 95 21:37

And its a Zippy New Year with a wonderful 5 page article by Sarah
Ferguson in the very latest HIGH TIMES (february issue). The saga
of the zippy evolution continues. More later.

house.54.172: Fuzzy Logic (phred) Mon 2 Jan 95 22:03

owlmed, get thee to a library and look at a basic anthropology text on
North American native societies. There were at least 500 tribes in the
Northwest *alone* less than 200 years ago. And while there were some
broad similarities among those groups, the diversity just in this one
corner of the continent was astonishing. How you can be so precise in
saying that "only 12 of them" were any particular thing is beyond me.

In general, I sense that this discussion is degenerating into a lot of
one-way orations, so I'm bowing out, for the time being.

house.54.173: David Dei (megatrip) Tue 3 Jan 95 00:56

Surely if there were merely ONE example of just, compassionate,
partnership society over a period long enough to prove that it was not
just a generational thing, THAT WOULD BE ENOUGH. And if there was merely
one example of a human not flawed by greed and fear, that would be
enough. And what would this prove? That at the very least, humans are
cabable of compassionate living, and that we too are capable.

house.54.174: Fraser Clark (megatrip) Tue 3 Jan 95 01:17

Just a quick comment on the "one way orations" charge - honestly, when
almost a whole culture has been brainwashed all their lives to believe the
same picture of Life as a sordid ego-centered scrabble of competitive
monkeys and rats, with everyone vying to disprove any hope for change or
consciousness-evolution, and suddenly for a glorious week or so we manage
to rise above all this materialistic scientific patriarchal pessimism to
glimpse optimism and a thousand alternatives, for someone to then chip in
that it's become one way oratory - I dunno, it seems to me that the one
way oratory is elsewhere, not here, here we're open to many different
models of reality and it's like a breeze of fresh air. Surely it's only
one way oratory when everyone's quoting the same school of authorities,
no? Fraser..

house.54.175: drugs, internet, BOO! (reid) Tue 3 Jan 95 11:02

which week are you talking about cause it wasn't last week. Last week was

house.54.176: Fraser Clark (megatrip) Tue 3 Jan 95 19:54

High Times, February 1995


*Who are the Zippies? Are they techno-hippies tripping into the future?
Or are they brilliant media pranksters of the moment? Sarah ferguson
takes a look at the hype.*

"Fraser! Fraser! Med -i-a!" It's Frank Veetjens, a 29 year old rave
promoter from Vancouver, Canada, tearing around the slopes of Arizona's
Kaibab National Forest in search of Fraser Clark, chief guru of the
Zippies. Clark and his much-hyped crew of British and American
techno-hippies have come to this remote mountaintop to stage their Grand
Canyon Omega Rave, an ecstatic trance-dance happening intended to "touch
the mythical clitoris of the USA". Never mind that we're 100 miles south
of the Canyon, or that Clark's forecast of 60000 ravers is about 55000
short. The world's media are here in force - a slew of French reporters
from Paris-Match, Actuel and the chic weekly VSD, plus Britain's Channel
4, Der Spiegel, Newsweek, Outside, i-D, National Public Radio, the Sydney
Morning Herald and assorted photo agencies. After a few more shouts, the
51 year old Clark emerges from a wooded hillock, dragging a sleeping bag
behind him, bits of grass falling from his mane of strawberry-blond hair.
He's looking bleary, having spent most of the night smuggling in a 36000
watt sound system for tonight's rave. But with the first camera flash,
his eyes begin to glimmer with an infectious twinkle. "ZIPPIES FOIL COPS
AT CANYON MEGA RAVE LOVE-IN" Clark babbles in his lilting Scottish brogue,
pumping the half dozen reporters with ready-made headlines. "Can I borrow
your laptop? I need to get a shot of Fraser with it" a reporter from
Italy's Panorama askes me. "Sure, but you know the Zippies don't have any
computers here" I say. "Yes, but it's the image" the photographer
acknowledges. "It's a Zippy thing." So much for objectivity. Here, in
Arizona, Clark doesn't need a computer. He's got the world's press corps
conspiring with him to create a virtual reality of cyber hippy comunion.

A cynic might view the scene as a wilful media hoax. To Clark and his
loopy posse of Zippies (or Zen Inspired Pagan Professionals) it's yet
another symptom of "pronoia" - the sneaking suspicion that others are
conspiring behind your back to help you. So what if most of the 5000
campers scattered across the forest are actually hippies and New Agers
who've assembled for the World Unity Festival, a week-long spiritual
gathering for peace? By holding a rave in the midst of the neotribal
event, Clark and crew are hoping to invoke the kind of cultural crossover
that fuelled Britain's own Summer of Love in 1988, when thousands of
ecstasy-crazed club kids teamed up with the nomadic bands of hippies and
punks roaming the countryside to create vast, outlaw rave parties. Clark
coined the term 'Zippy' to express this unlikely fusion af anarchic
hippies and cyber-savvy techno freaks. But he's not really a leader of a
movement so much as a purveyor of symbol. Dubbed by the British press as
the "Timothy Leary of the E generation", Clark is looking to bootstrap the
hedonic bliss and communal vibe of the rave party into a mass movement for
planetary awakening. "Rave is the cultural meme - or virus - of a new
lifestyle" he tells me, puffing on a rolled cigarette after the first wave
of reporters has passed. "You could call it awakening buried
consciousness through the ego-meltdown of the tribal dance. So you don't
need a program, just get people in tune and they'll come together."

Sounds a bit like the utopian ideals that have been floating around the
rave scene for the past 5 years. But Clark's pitch adds a millennial
twist: "The system is collapsing" he maintains. "We have to reduce our
consumption by about 75%. If everyone in the West did that, there would
be no problem on an ecological level". "So how do you persuade millions of
Westerners to voluntarily reduce their consumption? You create a new
lifestyle - the Zippy - and make it fashionable. And the way you do that
is you start out in England, where youth fashion begins, build it up, then
jump it to America, which controls most of the media. And from there you
get it sent around the planet". That, at least, was the plan when Clark
announced the Zippy Pronoia Tour To US in a WIred cover story last May.
Hyping the Zippies as the next "British invasion", the article excited an
unprecedented stir on the internet - more than 40000 posts in less than
three months. It also provoked an angry backlash from folks in America's
electronic underground who accused Clark and his crew of trying to ride
the coattails of their party. ... Worse still, Clark was breaking a
fundamental taboo of the underground by hustling yet another
alterna-culture to the media. At a time when the world's youth are forced
to endure their every passing fad being picked over by marketing analysts
in pursuit of the next Nike ad, the Zippy pitch - combining the
entrepreneurial zeal of the yuppie with the spiritual indulgence of the
hippie - sounded dangerously close to a Fruitopia commercial. There is,
after all, something disconcerting about making spiritual renewal
*fashionable*. But Clark sees no conflict in using the tools of Madison
Avenue to get his concept across. "The media have become one of the
tribes we're gathering" he explains. "For the first couple of nights out
here, most of them were living in hotels. Now they're on site, living in
tents, getting turned on, falling in love. They can't help but be
affected by this. And the more they keep reporting this, the more they're
contaminated by the virus. They become part of the conspiracy to spread
the meme. This is underground SHAMANARCHY bubbling up the corridors of


house.54.177: J. Robert Oppenheimer (mc2) Tue 3 Jan 95 23:16


house.54.178: Fuzzy Logic (phred) Wed 4 Jan 95 00:03

A gentle reminder . . . it's not considered good form on the Well to
repost lengthy excerpts from copyrighted sources without permission.
The "fair use" rules, which are admittedly vague, would probably not
allow for excerpts of this length.

The article seems fair enough, but I rather prefer the one that appeared
in the Sunday Review magazine of the Sunday Independent of London last July.

house.54.179: Fraser Clark (megatrip) Wed 4 Jan 95 00:23

High Times, February 1995


All this might seem like blatant self-promotion coming from someone else.
But Clark possesses an almost childlike sincerity, the sincerity of a
born-again pagan who's seen the future in a disco ball. He and his
companion Zana - a 32 year old woman with shoulder length hairweaves and
the venturesome innocence of Peter Pan - truly believe that they're riding
the winds of prophecy. And seeing them out here in the woods, surviving
on Oodles of Noodles without even a tent to sleep in, it's impossible not
to get caught up in their enthusiasm. It is, after all, kind of a cosmic
goof that the ZIppies made it here, given the flakiness of Clark's
operation. When Clark told Wired that he was organising a mega rave at a
Rainbow Gathering at the Grand Canyon, he was winging it, trusting in "the
Goddess" to make it happen. Actually, the Rainbow Family was holding its
own annual powwow in Wyoming in July. Only later did Clark actually hear
about the World Unity Festival. By Clark's way of thinking, some kind of
event to merge Hippy and Rave cultures was simply inevitable. It's almost
as if he invented the term Zippy to describe his own process of
self-realisation. The quintessential '60s drop-out, Clark tripped on acid
and spent the bulk of the '70s trekking the guru trail through India and
the far East. He came back to London in 1980, determined to translate the
ideals of the '60s to our increasingly technocratic age. In 1986 he began
publishing the underground 'Zippy' bulletin ENCYCLOPAEDIA PSYCHEDELICA
INTERNATIONAL, in which he predicted a "psychedelic wave" would shift the
consciousness of the planet. He spent a few summers hosting shamanistic
retreats in Wales. But when Acid house exploded in London two years
later, Clark knew he'd found his niche. Clark saw the seeds of a newly
mobile, countercultural force in club kids and even yuppies who were
trading in their 9-5 jobs to tour the "festi-rave" circuit in battered
caravans. He teamed up with some young designers, revamped the
Encyclopaedia into the more house-oriented zine evolution^, started a
record label and then began promoting renegade parties in and around
London. The Tory government's crackdown on outdoor raves only upped the
ante by giving the scene a political focus. With cops locking up
promoters and impounding peoples' cars, the right to party became a
unifying cause - one capable of bridging the disparate interests of
weekend ravers and scruffy New Age Travellers. Clark responded by opening
the club Megatripolis. There, the Zippy fusion came into full flower; a
typical night combined pulsing trance music and laser shows with hippy
craft stalls, virtual reality booths, smart drink bars and "edutainment"
by such psychedelic luminaries as Ram Dass and Alexander Shulgin. By last
spring Megatripolis was drawing 2000 people a night. But Clark had a
bigger audience in mind. Pumped by the Wired story, he and a posse of 14
"co-conspirators" arrived in New York last June, fueled by pronoia - and
not much else. They were sleeping on floors, borrowing sound systems and
monopolising the HIGH TIMES phones and computers. After a couple of
haphazardly arranged club gigs with mushroom guru Terence McKenna, the
Zippies set off for Colorado., confident they'd find a promoter to
bankroll their revolution.

Chaos ensued. The first promoter they worked with was shot at and
arrested. A second group reportedly offered $750000, but only if all the
profits from the Zippy tour as well as a planned MTV-style documentary and
club franchise were split 50/50. Bugging on no sleep, little food and too
many drugs, a faction of the Zippy crew convinced Clark that the promoters
were really Freemason spies out to coopt his movement. Zippy pronoia
devolved into raving paranoia. Clark blew off the deal - and with it any
hope of a mega rave. The Zippies did play a 1000 person party in the
mountains of Colorado near Golden as well as a smaller but much
anticipated gig at the Rainbow Gathering in Wyoming in July. They also
out-prankstered Merry Prankster Ken Kesey by taking over the stage at
Kesey's otherwise abysmal performance event at the Boulder Theatre on July
2nd. But when they hit California later that month, the Zippies totally
fell apart. With the anti-Fraser faction posting conspiracy-laden
messages all over the internet, Clark decided to pull the plug on the
Canyon party and redirect his energy towards opening a Megatripolis-style
club in San Francisco. Then he caught wind of of the European press,
which was hyping the mega rave as the true Woodstock of the '90s. Actuel
ran a full-page photo of a smiley face hovering over the rim of the
Canyon. Hype had overtaken reality, the show had to go on. At the last
minuite, a millionaire philanthropist donated $3000, enough to rent a
sound sytem. Clark dispatched Earth Girl, the West Coast's reigning smart
foods diva, and Frank, the Canadian promoter, to scout the scene, then put
the word on the Net that the rave was on. Still, Fraser and Zana had no
way to get to Arizona. "I was just waiting for the Goddess to play her
final ace" Clark grins. She came through in the form of a Bay Area sex
therapist/drug designer named Tex, who dropped by the magazine offices of
CLUBLIFE, where they had been crashing, and loaned them the cash to rent a

MORE TO COME/ RAY {Fraser says he will correct some of the facts here, but
is generally content to rest the Zippy case on Sarah's report.}

house.54.180: David Dei (megatrip) Wed 4 Jan 95 00:42

Hmmn, good point, - should this stuff be free or not? Or is rave
a scarce resource needing protection from piraters and reckless
perveyors of peace and love.

Actually its a damn good conspiracy to save the planet, on the
universes' behalf?

As for the last, point, I do believe one of the Well's founding fathers
got rich from the following maxim "Information wants to be free"?

As for protocol and the unwarrented fear of breaking these secular laws
that have got us by the balls. May all who drink from that well, have the
IRS audit them back to birth under the watchfull eyes of George Orwell
and Franz Kafka.

house.54.181: David Dei (megatrip) Wed 4 Jan 95 01:22

I suppose ec2 wDould rather be "pure" as the planet disappears totally
down the plughole. You do that, then, ec2, never let it be said you got
your hands dirty for your planet.

Ooops, phred. Thanks for the advice. Dunno what to do. It seems unfair
to all sides to stop now. Anyway, it's my guess we're going to increase
the sales of High Times quite a bit since Ray hasn't quoted the whole
thing ... and to say nothing about Gabe Kirchheimer's fabulous
photographs!!!! incl one of the Megatripolis opening night!in San

One thing I do want to correct. When Wired announced the mega rave in
their May isue (the interview actually took place the previous December),
we'd already been talking to more than one promoter and fully intended to
do it ourselves. Not that difficult, you understand. Then our liason
zippy in NY was approached by some of Michael Dimartino's posse to make
the mega rave part of his World Unity Fest. We agreed and stopped
preparations at that point. It wasn't till I went down there personally
in late July, after all sorts of weird and wonderful on-agains off-agains,
that I realised what a flaky organisation they had. Not knocking them,
mind you, indeed quite the opposite - any damn fool can do big things with
big bucks but it takes something else to make a thing this big and
important happen from an office in a caravan which is where Michael's
operation was being run from. But now here's my point: while I was there
somebody pointed out on the wall in Michael's kitchen a very similar
poster to the one that World Unity Fest had been passing out. Only this
one had Neil Young and other mega bands on it. I then realised that
Michael had been trying to get his World Unity Fest off the ground for
some years, making a run at it each year. I'm just about totally
convinced that it was the publicity we generated that kickstarted the
World Unty Fest into life.

house.54.182: Sharon Fisher (slf) Wed 4 Jan 95 08:11

}Dunno what to do.

Scribble it.

}Unfair to all sides to stop now.

Hardly. It is fair to the legal owner of the copyright.

}we're going to increase the sales of High Times quite a bit

I've heard people use that argument before to try to justify violating
copyright restrictions. It doesn't wash.

house.54.183: Daly City's only 24 hour drug store (mc2) Wed 4 Jan 95 08:38


house.54.184: Fuzzy Logic (phred) Wed 4 Jan 95 11:37

Thanks, Sharon.

As for "information wants to be free," well, sbb did not become rich or
even famous because of that quote, and besides, his meaning was a bit
more sophisticated than many naive users of that quote understand.

Anyway, that quote has been discussed a lot here although I don't have
direct pointers right at hand.

house.54.185: David Dei (megatrip) Wed 4 Jan 95 11:53

This conf is begining to sound like the Lenin Institute for disgruntled
DMV workers. :-)

Lets get on with the dialogue: All those for or against RAVE sinking the
system, and WHAT ARE WE PUTTING IN ITS PLACE, state your cases NOW (or
forever hold your pea soup)

[BTW Hopefully, we can all distinguish my postings from Fraser's despite
our pseud surfing! I know I can :)]

house.54.186: it will make me crazy! (miga) Wed 4 Jan 95 14:37

Well, as host here I'd like to request that the rest of the article not be
posted here unless you have permission from the author. Thanks. [that is,
I'm a host of the house music conf, where this topic originated. in fact,
a couple days ago ledelste asked a general question about whether there is
anything to raves beyond drugs, and I would invite discussion about this in
g house in any general topic, or start a new one.]

Speaking only as myself now, I'd say the FC/Leary comparison is right on -
however I do not really mean that as a compliment to either, I'm afraid.
The house/rave scene in SF was going strong years before the Zippies were
invented, and the Megatripolis concept wasn't revolutionary either - Your
Sister's house had discussions and speakers at their weekly parties without
all the hype. We did it as a collective, underground, and we fed people at
our parties as well. I think that Clark and Company havew their hearts in
the right place but it is too easy to get caught up in hype, fashion and
fame when substantial change is really supposed to be the goal. Also, all
this having to be the first and only smacks not only of PR-hype but worse,
it is a monotheistic dominator-culture style unwinnable game, and a waste of
effort, given the enormous task of changing the world.

When the Zippies came to SF last summer they didn't bother to go to a single
party which they weren't putting on, including the Full Moon and Sunset.
Why not? In this context, RC sounds to me like Recieved Culture, imposed
from above with no attention to what people were actually doing.

I don't mean to be harsh. I have been impressed by the willingness of the
Zippis to remain in the dialog and talk with those who disagree with them.
But I still find myself with many of the questions I had when the first Zippy
topic was opened - what is the point of all the hype, and what is
actually being done to achieve the stated goals, beyond hoping things will
turn out ok? As a real raver, though one with far more modest hopes for the
future, I want to know these things, because all the attention in the press
does have it's effect on the scene here, which has grown and been built
over years.

house.54.187: Young Owl Hatching (owlmed) Wed 4 Jan 95 15:54


house.54.188: jonl (jonl) Wed 4 Jan 95 20:58

We've been doing that kinda stuff in Austin for years, too, whether the
prevailing scene chose to notice or not.

Re copyright...best bet is to get permission from the author, who might
well give it... it's her words, her right to control context. Which has
nothing to do with Stewart's oft misquoted phrase...he told me himself
that he meant 'you're responsible for your words,' and wasn't even thinking
of the proprietary sense of 'own.' (That's in the original quote, which
I think was later expanded.)

The idealistic notion that a particular person's form of expression should
belong to the world would unfortunately tend to crater artistic and
intellectual flowering everywhere...if you can't have some guarantee of
pay for your expression, then you hafta work in the factory to pay the
bills, y'know? "Poetry don't feed the bulldog," as Jim Whitaker used to say.

house.54.189: David Dei (megatrip) Wed 4 Jan 95 23:56

A word from RU Sirius on this issue would be welcome, viz the rise of
post-scarcity economics?

Regarding the "who did what when in rave" this chicken vs egg debate, lets
put it down to "morphic resonance", however I do think that one of the
most overlooked aspects of Fraser's contribution is his emphasis on the
socio-political nature of Raving. And this is not merely in the realm of
abstract feelgood oneworldism but in the streetwise, physical sense. The
need for a comprehensive social critique is obvious in the light of the
NEW YEAR party purge by the SF Gestapo. As long as our right to dance is
denied by the system, we can never be free. Rave is not merely drug
induced shamanic reverie, but rather an expression of
community-in-the-moment. An ever-evolving alternative culture clubbing

house.54.190: Fraser Clark (megatrip) Thu 5 Jan 95 03:38

Well, although the majority of rules in our lives these days probably
deserve to be broken, this doesn't feel like one of them. Break the
connection, Ray! (I still say, though, that if I were handling PR for
High Times, I'd be perfectly happy in the slightly longer term.) I'm with
you, owlmed, damn good posting!

Let me try to BEGIN to answer some of the points raised.
1} Is there
anything to raves beyond drugs? Well, nobody (not even my enemies) has
ever tried to dismiss me as a drugs guru. I DO, of course, agree
wholeheartedly with Terence that, if our central problem is that we have
lost touch with our inner and external nature, and we want her advice, the
most natural way would be to EAT her and she will speak to us. That seems
to me self-evident. Of course once might be enough for one person's vision
or some may not be attracted at all to these particular techniques -
CERTAINLY there should be no obligation or fashion about any of this.
Indeed the whole attempt that has to be made to shamanically Reconnect
must include any and all techniques that are personally relevant, from
Dance to Massage/Touch to Sex to Childbearing to PlanetCommunityCare etc.
Of course, when we use this demonised word "drugs", we must focus it very
carefully on the psychedleics and empatheogens (or however the scientific
elite are defining them these days).

In fact, rather than confine the proposed new discussion topic to Rave V
Drugs (which has probably run the gamut several times over the last half
dozen years and is probably a designer dead-end) I propose the discussion
be - RAVE AS THIRD MILLENNIAL SHAMANISM. This is a topic where those who,
believing that shamanic reconnection (AND FAST) is the last real hope for
our species (viewed as a finite number of individuals), and accepting that
Rave at its best is a modern form of shamanic activity, are forced to
conclude that there is no way you can exclude psychedelics and
empatheogens from being in our quiver of shamanic techniques.

2} The house/rave scene was not going strong in SF before zippy was
invented, I'm afraid. The zippy concept, philosopphy and predictions (of
the Rave scene itself) predate Rave by several years. The zippy quarterly
Encyclopaedia Psychedelica 9 welcomed the appearance of the Rave in London
with the headline ACID HOUSE MUSIC TO OUR EARS, the first printed medium
in the world to welcome it, so far as I have ever heard.

3} But did Your Sisters house have Your Sisters house as we did, huh?
"Substantial change" is the key. As I see it, we're talking half a dozen
years to make it. (See previous postings on this). Let me be frank -
let's all be frank, for Gods sake. I have personally been working
underground since 1965, and have been satirised by the media for 2 decades
for my beliefs. I put on free events for years in the early part of RC
(usually LOST money and then, exhausted from my efforts to help people
grow while having a good time, had to go out and make a living on top of
the debts too). I and evolution^, the posse I helped birth at that time,
were laughed at by the media and scorned by the "cool" rave scene in
London. I'm not complaining, though that doesn't mean every minute was
fun. Then Megatripolis exploded onto the scene - 2500 networking people
from all the previously separate scenes every Thursday and masses of media
attention spreading a whole new zippy meme (Rainbow Ravers is the current
definition) So now the media is picking up on us, not because we've
changed, but because the world has been catching up in a big way and a lot
of what we were saying has come about. We're didn't come here to put on
free little raves to help the local community, but to ally with the
highest people on the planet who gather here in SF and, with their help,
to spread a new meme across the planet. What is wrong with that - please?
One example: In 1987 we announced to ravers through evolution^ metazine
CHANGE SOCIETY." People ignored it then as many will do here but that
don't make it wrong. Being loved by all and in general agreement with
most DOES NOT NECESSARILY mean you're doing what you should be doing. If
the New Year crackdown we're hearing about is true and continues we're all
going to be much more politicalised by next New Year. (Check out my
editorial in December's CLUBLIFE. Do nationwide renegade parties next
summer in the national forest land attacked live on TV every night look a
little less like hype to you now? Probably not yet - because you still
don't really see the power of this massive growing people movement of
which you are a part of, but I'm saying you will and that's why I'm here -
to say it.

Having to be the first is unimportant - having to be trying harder all the
time, yes. To be the only - NO! Quite the reverse. We say Zippy because
it's the balance of Tecno&Hippy that we think everyone is striving for.
And we mean everyone. Across the planet, not only in London or the Bay
Area. The whole world needs to change - as fast as possible before we're
finally poisoned and strangled to death. The dominaotor culture will
continue to beat our best efforts EASILY as long as we only act locally.
Rave, the Great Ego Meltdown, is everywhere too now. People are waking up
everywhere, faster and faster. Let's put out our meme through every way
we can and connect across the globe in every way we can. Let's have
spokesmen on the meida telling it like it is rather than Dan Rather who's
never been to a raveI repeat: WHAT IS WRONG WITH THAT??

5} When the Zippies came to SF last summer they didn't bother to go to a
party which they weren't putting on, including the Full Moon and Sunset.
Why not? In this context, RC sounds to me like Recieved Culture,
from above with no attention to what people were actually doing.

I don't mean to be harsh. I have been impressed by the willingness of the
Zippis to remain in the dialog and talk with those who disagree with them.
But I still find myself with many of the questions I had when the first
topic was opened - what is the point of all the hype, and what is
actually being done to achieve the stated goals, beyond hoping things will
turn out ok? As a real raver, though one with far more modest hopes for
future, I want to know these things, because all the attention in the press
does have it's effect on the scene here, which has grown and been built
over years.

It's true that we had no time to check out what everyone else was up to
the moment we hit New York, actually. (I'd been consciously tracking the
in SF for years, though) We did quite a bit, you know, came to a
country few
of us had visited before, captured the attention of the media and
hopefully got
out some pro-rave messages to millions of people who are not yet ravers
think small group - when we went underground in the '60s it was because
we were
outnumbered and they all had guns. But the idea was not to stay
underground -
it was to regroup, re-work out what we were about and what the planet
needed and
then come out an take over the overground when we were ready.)

The battle to save the planet and ourselves and to return to sanity (not
golden age, we're not pollysannas) takes place in the hearts and minds of
all of
us. The local rave is the local opening point. Books need to be written
on all
this, of course, but if you continue to remain "one with far more modest
for the future" there's no hope for the future at all. Get up off your
girl. Save this planet for our children. Look at it this way: if
could have the experience Rave has given you, wouldn't that alone be
enough to
swing the whole thing round? What's so far fetched about that? Why is
it so
much to try to help everyone get that change. What's so beyond our grasp
Bad fashions spread globally through the media. Good ones can spread
fast - especially if people are there in their private thoughts already

house.54.191: Robert Lauriston (duck) Thu 5 Jan 95 10:45

"The way I keep stating it is: 'Information wants to be free,' because
it's so easy to transmit; 'information wants to be expensive,' because
it's so valuable."

--Stewart Brand, Whole Earth Review, Winter 1986

The author of an article may or may not have permission to allow
republication--it all depends on the contract with the publisher.
Of course, with modems and online service accounts in the hands of
rude, ignorant, irresponsible, immature assholes, stuff will be
stolen and passed around regardless.

house.54.192: RUSirius (rusirius) Thu 5 Jan 95 11:14

"a few words on post-scarcity economics"...

in reference to liberating high times copywrited text or...?

actually, i'm sure high times would be delighted by your quoting them...

there are some people where you just know... so why stand on ceremony...

but CALL THEM since it's been asked...

as for post-scarcity... yes, i must admit that the hippie/slacker/zippie
contingent represents at least 2 things that this culture has to do before
can move forward.... 1) legalize drugs 2) ditch the work ethic

house.54.193: Will Kreth (kreth) Thu 5 Jan 95 15:59

}2} The house/rave scene was not going strong in SF before zippy was
} invented, I'm afraid.

Ahem, Fraser - you weren't here and you don't know how strong the rave
scene was in '90-'92. {miga} was and does. So do a lot of people. A lot
of people who think Rushkoff's "Cyberia" got it very wrong. I'll be
honest - I wasn't directly involved with the s.f. rave scene then,
but a lot of my good friends and co-workers were. And now it's
mutated into something else. As it should.

}Books need to be written on all this, of course, but if you continue
}to remain "one with far more modest hopes for the future" there's no
}hope for the future at all. Get up off your knees, girl.
}Save this planet for our children.

I'd dare say it's time you got up off your high-horse, sir, and
stop calling adults children. Your utter paucity of humility is
painfully obvious. You sound like the vapid sloganeering of the
Hard Rock Cafe. "Save The Planet" - great. Just try using some
economy of words to make your arguments, or it will soon be time to
{forget} this topic.

house.54.194: Young Owl Hatching (owlmed) Thu 5 Jan 95 16:41


house.54.195: David Dei (megatrip) Thu 5 Jan 95 20:02

Ahem, Fraser - you weren't here and you don't know how strong the rave
scene was in '90-'92. {miga} was and does. So do a lot of people. A lot"

I think Fraser was referring to his own Rave Activities back in 1987.
Personally, I came across his work in summer of 88/89 (southern
hemisphere). In which case it becomes irrelevent to argue the point about
what San Francisco was doing in 1990??????

house.54.196: Larry Edelstein (ledelste) Thu 5 Jan 95 23:41

I tried to get this in at #163 but it was ignored.

I've been to raves and they are...OK. I didn't talk to a single person
other than those with whom I came and no one came up to me with brotherhood
in their eyes and started chatting. For one rave, I was up on X and I
enjoyed it; the others were pretty boring.

I like dancing and dancing and dancing. I like doing it until morning,
sometimes. But not that often. And I'm not alone. Plenty of people
would find raves to be boring. The whole phenomenon has a limited
appeal. I don't think a whole lot of people are ever going to go to
these events.

Hence, I don't see how Rave Culture is going to change the world.

house.54.197: David Dei (megatrip) Thu 5 Jan 95 23:55

The secret is: GO UP TO THOSE OTHER PEOPLE. Don't wait for brotherhood to
come your way. Surprisingly true. NOW if you were really on E, you should
have been glowing with love, more than enough to share with people who
you doon't know. WHat we see in the world is usually a projection of our
own inner state of being. So if you expect fear, you'll see it
everywhere. But if you give love, [for those who don't know, its that
warm feeling usually in your chest area, but flowing through ones entire
body], you are bound to receive some back. Which is why RC will change
the world, because this is really about teaching a whole lot of
individuals to FEEL. Discovering that you tend to enjoy yourself more if
you let go of your inhibitions and smile and love unconditionally, that
this Actually WOrks is what the "secret" is all about. Try it, and then
we can talk.

house.54.198: Wagner James Au (wjamesau) Fri 6 Jan 95 01:21

In other words, if you can't Feel the Love, something's obviously
wrong with *you*.

I wouldn't be so bothered by the efforts of the Converted to follow
their bliss, if an implicit self-proclaimed superiority to the
Unconverted wasn't always so explicitly attached to it.

house.54.199: Robert Lauriston (duck) Fri 6 Jan 95 09:25

}}Maybe we ought to all stop arguing who was raving first and figure out what
needs to be done with a society that most or all of us seem to be unhappy

Get loaded and shake your booty.

house.54.200: Young Owl Hatching (owlmed) Fri 6 Jan 95 13:18


house.54.201: Young Owl Hatching (owlmed) Fri 6 Jan 95 14:03


house.54.202: David Dei (megatrip) Fri 6 Jan 95 14:22

Quite a while back I published the following:

"This could be *the* most important social manifestation in the history.
of humanity Except we have become fixated on its value as just another
entertainment tool. Sex, Drugs, Music and Cyberspace in themselves are
uninteresting. They become more interesting when we look at them as tools
and expressions for how we run society and how we live our lives. Sexual
freedoms won at home are nothing without a corresponding awakening and
balancing of libidinal energy in society at large. Access to drugs is of
little use without a corresponding mytho-shamanic-decoding.
Rave-Music-Tranceploration might get you into a pomo-voudon reverie but
without a personal integration with social action it is mere
meminglessness. And Cyberspace is just another word for carpal tunnel
syndrome without a physically enhancing interface to our reality-scape."

So far, I've only had 10 rave experiences in the Bay Area,where the above
was true. The major problem as I see it, is breaking through the negative
programming that says a) I party because I want to Fuck b) I must stick
with my peer group, anyone older than me sucks.
But, surprisingly, it only takes a little effort by organisors/party
hosts to stop the alienation effect of Sex Lurking and get people to get
on down to the music. Dancing out of your head is but the first stage of
connecting with your body. And if it takes all night to arrive at that
space where everyone starts smiling and hugging each other for the sheer
love of it (not to get laid) then that's fine. Practice makes a perfect

house.54.203: David Dei (megatrip) Fri 6 Jan 95 14:28

And rereading my post, I should add the following:

Seeing Rave as a JOURNEY and not the end, as a MEANS to accomplishing a
more perfect society and NOT a substitute to this future perfect world,
is what I believe in!

house.54.204: it will make me crazy! (miga) Fri 6 Jan 95 16:00

Good point, #203, obviously it is not an end in itself. rave, in fact, is
just a form, as Larry points out. Like anything else, some are better than
others. There is not a formula. The thing that makes a good rave
such a unique experience is not any drug or track or bit of tech, it is the
interactions among the people who are there. This is why I think the
Zippies are wasting their time trying to get on television when they could
be truly subversive by connecting with people and working together with the
existing rave culture because so much more could be accomplished! It is a
waste of time hassling with the media when the net exists, if getting your
message out to people is truly what is important to you.

If rave culture is going to change the world it will not be by getting on
tv, it will be by it's encouragement of community. and you can't force
community, or create it out of nothing, it is an organic thing. It is so
odd to read Fraser talking community in one breath and in the next saying
there wasn't time to check out the local scene. it just doesn't make sense.
my point was not who was first, but rather that the idea of bringing rave
culture to san francisco in 1994 is just silly. If I were out to change the
world, I'd be networking and trying to help people get together to leverage
the strength they have. I'd be on the net and on the web. [BTW for those
of you who don't know me well, I am being sarcastic, I work at the WELL and
I AM out to change the world through getting people networked!] This I
Believe. d;)

house.54.205: Robert Lauriston (duck) Fri 6 Jan 95 16:54

The thing that makes a rave such a unique experience is ignorance of
cultural history.

house.54.206: let your mind be your sun (tow) Fri 6 Jan 95 17:16


house.54.207: Fuzzy Logic (phred) Fri 6 Jan 95 18:12

Yes, I think that's bunk. I know a damn lot about cultural history and
rave has some affinities with some aspects of our own American cultural
history (all-night hollers, house parties, early rock'n'roll, Acid Tests,
many others) and in some senses it is/was quite different.

Look, if you had gone to Cool World/Cow Palace or the DV8 mess last
Saturday night, you might well be justified in saying, "rave is OK but
the idea of it doing anything exceptional is simply not possible."
And on the other hand if you'd been to the Begin Again or Visual Aids
parties (up to the point where the latter was brutally busted by the
SFPD), it would have been possible to see it more favorably that way.

One of the things that makes the phenomenon so difficult to pin down
is the wide range of quality in "rave" gatherings. Some have all the
trappings and none of the vibe, some have very little glitz and still
pull off a powerful uplifting impact. And a lot of it has to do with
the qualities of those attending, not so much with the skills or
charisma of the performers (if you can even call DJs performers), which
is so much more the case in traditional performance forms like live
music and drama. You can't just order up a "good" crowd, it's partly
a matter of putting everything in the right sort of alignment (physical
location, operations, music, lighting), partly a matter of attracting
a good crowd and partly a matter of luck (and, as we well know, "the
phase of the moon" :-)

This acts as a self-limiting brake on the growth of the phenomenon.
It's not like saying in 1968, "wow you should see this amazing band
the Grateful Dead" and they usually *were* when you took your newbie
friends. Sometimes I've taken non-ravers to parties and wanted to
leave after two minutes because I knew it wasn't working out. The
experience, therefore, tends to be much more variable, but the *peak*
experience, when it happens, is simply amazing.

house.54.208: David Dei (megatrip) Sat 7 Jan 95 16:03

The only thing "limiting" the growth of the Rave Phenomenon is our
capacity to love. With practice, we find that spreading the ambiance of
unconditional love and compassion becomes easier. With each successfull
party a node or bifurcation point in our culture is created. From each
point, a myriad of further offshoots spring. Some successful, others not.
but the process builds on its own successes and so on. Eventually we will
reach a stage where critical mass is achieved. This is the idea of
Evolution being an intelligent, emotional force in itself. The may be
many other ways of looking at the same thing, but I am happy with this
one. As I said earlier, we can script this thing any way we want. But the
main thing is to make a personal decision: Do things work out for the
better, or is humanity just a failed experiment?

house.54.209: temp temp (dpd) Sat 7 Jan 95 17:37

I see no problem with seeking media attention - it reaches more people by
far than the Net as yet. My oldtimers problem with raves is I like to dance
to rocknroll.

house.54.210: Salmon Egg Brotherhood (mc2) Sat 7 Jan 95 20:32


house.54.211: David Dei (megatrip) Sun 8 Jan 95 13:01

What's really interesting is Rave's incorporation of folk elements. A
good example is Bhangra or Indian Rave which has taken the London Bombay
community by storm with its use of traditional instrumentation and
lyrics. This "world music" approach to rave is important and necessary.
Each one of us has some unique cultural heart-string-chord triggered from
our social wardrobe of experience. Thus many americans will find entry
point in Deep Purple, Led Zepplin, Hendrix riffs while an Armenian would
rather hear his Jaws Harp childhood memory or perhaps the sound of a Bazooki.
However, what I see is a definite trend to accomodate these cultural
differences. Soon, we will have evolved a 24 hour long song that
incorporates all elements necessary for all humans to dance together.
Think of this as the alternative Space Race.

house.54.212: Fuzzy Logic (phred) Sun 8 Jan 95 18:13

Sheesh. I own the *only* two house/bhangra records I could find (one by
the KK Kings and the other a compilation on Tribal UK) and though I'm
sure there are more, (1) bhangra is most definitely *not* "Indian Rave"
and (2) the music has more affinity with hip hop than house, from what
I can tell.

I am actually particularly interested in these kinds of music hybrids, but
the good ones are few and far between. It will take some time for the
musical ferment going on in many different styles to converge and produce
new syncretic forms.

house.54.213: Will Kreth (kreth) Sun 8 Jan 95 19:23

We put samples of tracks from the Dhol Blasters' CD "Bangratulations" up in
the Soundz section of HotWired.

Everyone likes the Bhangra/hip-hop sound around the office. The vocals are
wonderfully hilarious. Great rhythms and a great hybrid.

house.54.214: David Dei (megatrip) Sun 8 Jan 95 21:27

Am I missing something here, or are people on this continent unable to
appreciate the complexities of cultural interfacing. It seems like we are
getting back to the murky water of "Rave is only 120bpm" "no its not its
129.9Bpm" ad infinitum. To use an analogy, no matter what baud your modem,
you're still using a modem, and it still is the internet at any baud.
Bhangra is a massive cultural step as was Mbaqanga. The idea is to see
the pattern in these seemingly disimilar movements. In fact I can just
see the expression on the Tswana Induna's face coming across a
contingent of Zippy Rave Engineers, as he walks along the dust road of an
african landscape "Hmmm, that music they're listening to sounds like
Mbaqanqa, only a bit faster. They're getting with my culture"

And then you breeze into Bombay and a similar sahdu points out that this
techno thing youre doing sound like his latest Bhangra tape.

And then you trip into outer Mongolia....

I hope someone is getting the picture here?

house.54.215: David Dei (megatrip) Sun 8 Jan 95 21:36

BTW to illustrate what isolation does (re finding only two Bhangra tapes)

Where is the biggest cinema market/producer/audience in the world situated?




exceeding LA output by about 300%


The Zippy Pronoia Tour site was developed by cubensis@well.com © 1995.
Extra special thanks to the gracious, skoochin' internet love-fest.